Iron Tower Studio ForumsRPGThe Age of Decadence (Moderator: Vahha)Need some lines - any help?
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Craftsman

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« Reply #30 on: May 17, 2013, 10:24:03 pm »

Fair enough.  I was making unwarranted assumptions based on my reading of the OP; it seemed to suggest the skill system change was basically cosmetic and made no mention of altering the difficulty of NPC opponents.  Of course, alter the skill system AND the opponents, and it is basically cosmetic, the OP is accurate as well as correct that there is no freak out required, and I'm a bit of an idiot Smile
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Vahha
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« Reply #31 on: May 18, 2013, 12:51:05 am »

Why change the difficulty of combat encounters if things can be corrected by modifying SP gain for quests?
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Dragatus
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« Reply #32 on: May 18, 2013, 01:39:13 am »

Quote
Streetwise

It's visible that you were running out of ideas...
Being overloaded, I figured that I would cut a few corners by copy-pasting similar skills (like persuasion and streetwise, swords and daggers, etc) and just tweaking a few words. No good?

That would be a reasonable aproach if you did it all by yourself because you've got plenty of other things to work on. But since you outsourced the job of making the descriptions to the fans I think every skill should have unique descriptions.

Why change the difficulty of combat encounters if things can be corrected by modifying SP gain for quests?

I can think of two reasons: realism and variety of character builds.

For realism, AoD is not a game where a player should have too many high skills. Regardless of whatever build you end up having, it should be believable that a human could achieve it.

As for variety, it's not so clear cut whether inceasing SP would improve or reduce it, but basically you can create the largest number of different builds when the amount of SP you get is somewhere in the middle.


OK, now let me give it a try:

Bow

1. You're more likely to hurt your forearm than to hit the target.
2. You still have trouble hitting your targets, but at least you stopped hurting your forearm when firing arrows.
3. You can hit a stationary target. At close range. If there is no wind.
4. If the conditions are favorable your arrows tend to hit stationary targets, just not exactly where you aimed at.
5. You've become a decent archer. With a little luck you can even hit moving targets.
6. Your arrows find their targets more often than not, even if the target is moving.
7. Your arrows strike true.
8. Few archers can match your skill.
9. People swear that they've seen your arrows seek out their targets on their own.
10. If it rains you can stay dry by shooting raindrops out of the sky.

As someone who has recently picked up archery I can vouch for the truth of the first two lines.  smug
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"A little while ago, a good friend's wife asked me what playing Dungeons & Dragons involved. Long story short, it turns out that it's basically improv without an audience or time pressure, and a lot of rules. Every time anyone wants to attempt something, it's basically subject to a referee. Who is incidentally trying to kill you. In a fair and impartial manner." - Priapist

A Basic Guide to Combat in age of Decadence
AbounI
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« Reply #33 on: May 18, 2013, 05:59:54 am »

Awesome work all.

May I suggest you to place nice easter egg in somme description, like the "arrow in the knee" or the "never ask for this".Such description would fit, no?

like bow: unskilled: "you know to shoot your own knee"  lol

Couldn't be the same things be applied for the six stats?
« Last Edit: May 18, 2013, 06:31:11 am by AbounI » Logged
MidnightSun
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« Reply #34 on: May 18, 2013, 06:50:37 am »

Max. sword skill - "Sword of the morning". Hellz, yeah.
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Vince
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« Reply #35 on: May 18, 2013, 10:44:54 am »

That would be a reasonable aproach if you did it all by yourself because you've got plenty of other things to work on. But since you outsourced the job of making the descriptions to the fans I think every skill should have unique descriptions.
I concur.

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Oscar
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« Reply #36 on: May 18, 2013, 11:26:40 am »

Max. sword skill - "Sword of the morning". Hellz, yeah.

Nice one Grin
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vincentvega
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« Reply #37 on: May 18, 2013, 01:33:11 pm »

I'm not sure about all of this,I was "hoping" for the etiquettes and I'm happy about them,even though the new range makes it simpler to understand how good you are...but the descriptions seem very unnecessary,they're funny and all but add nothing in my opinion..
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100kg
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« Reply #38 on: May 18, 2013, 01:49:55 pm »

What about bonus points to skills which you can get during text adventures? For example
(click to show/hide)
?
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Dragatus
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« Reply #39 on: May 18, 2013, 02:03:10 pm »

What about bonus points to skills which you can get during text adventures? For example
(click to show/hide)
?

That's a good point. Unlike as with Critical Strike, you can't just increase CS chance permanently.

Maybe they could reduce the cost of increasing the skill? So if your Etiquette is 2 it normally costs 10 sp to improve it, but if you get a +1 Etiquette bonus from a TA the cost drops to 9.

Edit: I also considered increasing the skill by 1, but only if it's low enough. This aproach was used in Bloodlines and it didn't work out that well, since it encourages the player to have the skill at a specific value (the highest it can be which still allows you toget the bonus). And then we have the metagaming complaint again.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2013, 02:08:41 pm by Dragatus » Logged

"A little while ago, a good friend's wife asked me what playing Dungeons & Dragons involved. Long story short, it turns out that it's basically improv without an audience or time pressure, and a lot of rules. Every time anyone wants to attempt something, it's basically subject to a referee. Who is incidentally trying to kill you. In a fair and impartial manner." - Priapist

A Basic Guide to Combat in age of Decadence
Oscar
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« Reply #40 on: May 18, 2013, 02:33:57 pm »

What about bonus points to skills which you can get during text adventures? For example
(click to show/hide)
?

That's a good point. Unlike as with Critical Strike, you can't just increase CS chance permanently.

Maybe they could reduce the cost of increasing the skill? So if your Etiquette is 2 it normally costs 10 sp to improve it, but if you get a +1 Etiquette bonus from a TA the cost drops to 9.

That's a possibility, but we don't like it much. We are more interested in converting those situations into perks with unique gameplay consequences, but we'll see about it.

Edit: I also considered increasing the skill by 1, but only if it's low enough. This aproach was used in Bloodlines and it didn't work out that well, since it encourages the player to have the skill at a specific value (the highest it can be which still allows you toget the bonus). And then we have the metagaming complaint again.

We definitely won't do that.
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Wrath of Dagon
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« Reply #41 on: May 18, 2013, 11:35:42 pm »

How about awarding SP depending on where you are in the game, instead of as a reward for what you do?  It would make different paths easier to balance and make the game more replayable if you didn't feel obligated to do every side quest on every replay. Also the more you fight, the harder the subsequent battles should be (that is the enemies would gain the SP), because if you fight a lot you don't want to be rewarded with easier battles, you want harder ones. This would also make a character who only fights occasionally actually be able to win a battle now and then.
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Secondly--MURDER? Merely because I had planned the duel and provoked the quarrel! Never had I heard anything so preposterous.
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« Reply #42 on: May 19, 2013, 02:07:40 am »

@Oscar
I like the sound of special perks.

@Wrath of Dagon
I'm sceptical about the first suggestion.

The player needs to be rewarded for completing side quests and SP are the simplest and most appreciated reward available. In addition many of the optional quests require more effort and a better developed character than if you just do what's required to move the story forward.

The more you fight, the harder battles become is interesting, but I'm afraid it would come out as too "gamey". It would make sense in cases when the opposition knows that you might be coming, but otherwise it could feel artificial. It also smells a bit of leveling and I already get enough of that in TES.
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"A little while ago, a good friend's wife asked me what playing Dungeons & Dragons involved. Long story short, it turns out that it's basically improv without an audience or time pressure, and a lot of rules. Every time anyone wants to attempt something, it's basically subject to a referee. Who is incidentally trying to kill you. In a fair and impartial manner." - Priapist

A Basic Guide to Combat in age of Decadence
Wrath of Dagon
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« Reply #43 on: May 19, 2013, 01:02:02 pm »

I don't know why a player needs to be rewarded for sidequests. You do them to see the content and as a challenge, but other than that you shouldn't have to keep doing the same things over and over even though you're following different paths through the game, it really gets tedious. I suppose it wouldn't hurt to get some money or a one time use item as a reward. As far as harder battles being gamey, I think too much realism hurts gameplay. Plus in addition to sending tougher enemies against you, people tend to step up their game when challenged, there's any number of real world examples for that, so that is fairly realistic as well.
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Secondly--MURDER? Merely because I had planned the duel and provoked the quarrel! Never had I heard anything so preposterous.
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« Reply #44 on: May 21, 2013, 08:52:09 am »

Maybe I've been condition by all the RPGs I've played, but it doesn't feel like a quest unless I get some EXP out of it.

I do agree that doing the same things over and over again while trying to follow different paths does get tedious, but I don't think that's going to really be an issue in AoD since you have so many ways to aproach each situation.
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"A little while ago, a good friend's wife asked me what playing Dungeons & Dragons involved. Long story short, it turns out that it's basically improv without an audience or time pressure, and a lot of rules. Every time anyone wants to attempt something, it's basically subject to a referee. Who is incidentally trying to kill you. In a fair and impartial manner." - Priapist

A Basic Guide to Combat in age of Decadence
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