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Author Topic: Let's play AoD!  (Read 562716 times)
GhanBuriGhan
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« Reply #525 on: January 31, 2008, 03:34:44 pm »

Nick feels that the let's play thread generates more work than we are ready to handle at the moment, like the bolt fighting thing and various scripts

The man quite obviously has a point. Confused
You are much too nice over here - mayb leaving the codex behind has made you soft  Wink
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cardtrick
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« Reply #526 on: January 31, 2008, 04:07:00 pm »

If I have time, sure. Unfortunately, between my work (the company keeps expanding, which increases my workload - more sales reps, coordinators, managers to hire, train, and deal with), AoD work, mutiny (Nick feels that the let's play thread generates more work than we are ready to handle at the moment, like the bolt fighting thing and various scripts), and some articles/interviews, I don't have a lot of time to dedicate to the let's play thread.

All of this is reasonable, and I think we've all come to a better understanding of why the "Release it now damnit!" people are wrong, except that I don't really agree with Nick's mutiny. After all, you're going to have to deal with that work at some point no matter what, and there's no reason the Let's Play has to go at a normal Let's Play rate. I think it's totally fine if the Let's Play turns up an issue that needs to be worked on and then doesn't resume for 2 weeks or so until there's a chance to fix things. In fact, I think the Let's Play serves a really useful purpose in bringing to light things that are going to need to be implemented in the game that might not otherwise have been considered until too late. Hopefully having this thread will expose many issues earlier than they would otherwise be seen, and thereby shorten the inevitable alpha and beta testing periods before release.

People keep getting sick of the discussion and debate that's been going on this thread, and some seem to be under the impression that the discussion is what's holding up the Let's Play. I think that's pretty clearly not the case. If we don't debate things and point out our concerns, what possible purpose does this exercise serve?

I think we all need to resign ourselves to the fact that this Let's Play is going to go very slowly. Moreover, there's nothing wrong with discussing things in this thread. Vince and crew will read what we write, and whatever input we can give is valuable. (I do think it would be nice, though, to have an index edited into the first post with links to each new update, so that new viewers don't need to sift through all the discussion to get to the "good stuff.") If I'm wrong, I'm sure Vince will correct me.
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galsiah
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« Reply #527 on: January 31, 2008, 04:34:00 pm »

Moreover, there's nothing wrong with discussing things in this thread.
Nothing wrong exactly, but I question its efficiency as the best way to organize discussion of issues. Having everything discussed in this thread either means dealing with everything as it comes up (which Nick seems to think is impractical), or ending up with a load of jumbled discussion that needs to be patiently sifted through, and can't easily be added to.

If the Let's Play thread continued at its own pace (whether slow or fast), and specific discussion were delegated to other threads - perhaps entitled "Let's Play Issue: ..." - things would be much simpler. In that way discussion could continue naturally on each issue, and be addressed/updated cleanly at any time. You could easily have links to the other threads from here, as well as an index of issues at the start.

I don't see any benefit to the current organization. Discussion should be facilitating development prioritization, not dictating it. I don't particularly care how fast the Let's Play progresses, but I do care about its usefulness for design/development.
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cardtrick
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« Reply #528 on: January 31, 2008, 04:52:29 pm »

Yeah, that's quite a good call. Obviously discussion will have to start in this thread, but I think you're right that once an issue gets a few posts (and especially if it goes on for a few pages) that Vince or another mod should split those posts off into a separate thread. I think it's a good idea to have them titled "Let's Play Issue: <blank>", and moreover the Let's Play should be edited to have a link to that new thread at whichever point the discussion cropped up.

On the other hand, that seems like quite a bit of work. Alternately, we could keep the thread like it is now, with the exception of having an index on the first post for new viewers, and one of us normal forum goers could start a stickied "Let's Play Discussion Summary" thread in which we post summaries of discussions and conclusions but no new discussion, so that when it comes time for the developers to revisit the issues they just have one clean thread with summaries, quotes, and links to look at.

The first way is probably ideal, but it relies on Vince (are there other moderators?) to deal with it, which may not be worth his time. The forum is hardly busy enough to have one of the members made into a moderator, but that could be another solution -- although pretty much the moderator's only task would be to prune the Let's Play thread.
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GhanBuriGhan
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« Reply #529 on: January 31, 2008, 05:09:17 pm »

Don't get me wrong, discussion is good, and I think we have seen some good results too. I am sure its part of why VD is doing this, too. However, we are the people that can debate RPG design for a year and find no end. We got maybe 3 minutes into the game. I mean no offense and I am sure there were valid arguments, but we have been debating gemstone and gold icons lately, just because Vince made a humourous comment about them. I mean - gemstone icons. This game is not going to improve in any measurable way because of the way gemstone icons are handled. Some discussion may simply not be useful and hold up discussion of more important issues. Outsourcing discussion is a good idea, and of course VD and co. should feel free to just ignore what doesn't interest them.
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"Merely killing those being mean to me. It's not my fault it's everyone in the world of AoD". (Vahhabyte)
Helian
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« Reply #530 on: February 01, 2008, 11:14:50 am »

Nothing wrong exactly, but I question its efficiency as the best way to organize discussion of issues. Having everything discussed in this thread either means dealing with everything as it comes up (which Nick seems to think is impractical), or ending up with a load of jumbled discussion that needs to be patiently sifted through, and can't easily be added to.
Exactly. As I pointed out earlier, discussion of things like rewording should be restricted to a very small group of able people, rather than getting them torn apart by ten fanatics, each of them convinced that his version is the best. It doesn't do any good and also turns the thread into a mess.
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Vince
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« Reply #531 on: February 06, 2008, 06:41:22 pm »

So our brave Titus has managed to kill Gracius the merchant and, after long debates, killed the guard and thoroughly looted the place, instantly feeling better about his future prospects.

After that he returned to the assassins guild to report and get paid...



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Vince
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« Reply #532 on: February 06, 2008, 06:48:01 pm »

A new quest! How exciting! Let's ask a few questions and then decide what to do next. When you ask about the map you took from the merchant, Neleos suggests to talk to Feng, a local loremaster. So, what would you like to do next:

1. Deal with the spies
2. Talk to Feng about the map
3. Visit the marketplace
4. Something else (specify)

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« Last Edit: February 06, 2008, 06:50:06 pm by Vince » Logged
Mephisto
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« Reply #533 on: February 06, 2008, 08:51:52 pm »

I say we should visit the loremaster. I want to know what this map is all about.
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Priapist
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« Reply #534 on: February 06, 2008, 08:52:55 pm »

I'd be hitting the markets to spend some of those Imperials. A (short) blade of some kind would be handy, and so would a few more crossbow bolts. With that taken care of, on to the spies. The map can wait.
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puppyonastik
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« Reply #535 on: February 06, 2008, 08:53:51 pm »

Beautiful work!

3. Let's visit the market place and get some supplies with our shiny new imperials before heading out on our mission or talking to Feng. That way we're prepared for what may come our way.
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Paranoid Jack
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« Reply #536 on: February 06, 2008, 09:11:57 pm »

I would ask about the map and then take the quest to kill the spies. Or vice versa.

The Ready for more work? paragraph threw me off a bit but after re-reading it I realized he was doling out orders to three of us.
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cardtrick
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« Reply #537 on: February 06, 2008, 09:59:20 pm »

Sounds great. No issues (amazing, yeah?) with any of the dialog. It's short, to the point, and yet full of character. I like Neleos' no-nonsense demeanor.

Well, I guess I may as well repeat the standard complaint I'm probably going to be bringing up every time: please don't use asterisks to denote actions. If you must use asterisks, at least put one at the end of the action too, but it would be much better to use either italics or (better still) put dialog in quotes and actions not in quotes. At first I was a little hesitant about this suggestion, but the more screens you've shown, the more right it has seemed. It looks as though a very significant number of dialog lines have actions embedded within them (which is something that I like a great deal), so I think the "novel-style" quotes/nonquotes method of distinguishing dialog and actions makes a lot of sense.

So, as for our plan -- markets first. We've got to be prepared. After that, let's go deal with the spies. From what Neleos said, it sounded pretty urgent, and we're still new so we'd better get in his good graces. Plus, money! (Anyway, who cares about some ratty old map? Smile)
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Frosty
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« Reply #538 on: February 07, 2008, 12:08:09 am »

Ok he paid me 200 to kill an unguarded helpless merchant. I wonder if he knew and hid the fact about the guard from me.
Now he wants me to kill two spies for 50 each, Spies by there nature are very alert and make difficult targets.

I think I better get my self well stoked maybe con some sucker in to buying this treasure map. And have a look around the mark’s house first to see if it’s a trap.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2008, 01:26:57 am by Frosty » Logged

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Special_Can
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« Reply #539 on: February 07, 2008, 12:21:15 am »

 Looking really nice. As for the choice, I choose market. We need a dagger...
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