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Author Topic: Let's play AoD!  (Read 562715 times)
TheLostOne
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« Reply #105 on: January 02, 2008, 11:53:45 am »

Okay so they exits.  I'm not a martial arts expert so I'm just going off of impressions.

Also, are there eastern style martial arts like that in this gameworld?  Seems slightly out of place.  Do you even have an unarmed combat skill?  Dodging would most likely be learned while training in whatever weapon you're learning.  Putting points into it seems to me more like focusing on a defensive state of mind in combat rather than learning arcane dodging techniques.  Sort of like a counter puncher in boxing.  If you're looking at it as some kind of Aikido thing then that's a different story.
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Vince
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« Reply #106 on: January 02, 2008, 11:55:14 am »

Quote from: Vince
initiating a small quest to trade it for a scroll on dodging techniques you don't know
Sounds good - but it'd be nice to have more than a simple fed-ex quest (or have it be very quick). Time a player spends on this quest is time he'll be spending away from other quests. If it's significantly less interesting, that might not be a good thing.
Here is what I was thinking:

You start with a scroll, and when you go to the loremaster, you get an extra dialogue option:

What can I get for this scroll?
The Circular Dodge technique? (going with the names from the link above here) I don't believe I have this one. I can pay you 100 imperials or I can give you a copy of the Sliding Retreat technique. What do you say?
...
Simple as that.
 
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Vince
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« Reply #107 on: January 02, 2008, 12:09:41 pm »

Also, are there eastern style martial arts like that in this gameworld?  Seems slightly out of place. 
That's just an example. We can go with Pankration - an ancient Greco-Roman form of unarmed hand to hand combat resembling the mixed martial arts of today.

Quote
Dodging would most likely be learned while training in whatever weapon you're learning.
True, but instead of going with one MORTAL COMBAT skill, for role-playing/character development  reasons it's more fun to split combat into several different skills.

Quote
Putting points into it seems to me more like focusing on a defensive state of mind in combat rather than learning arcane dodging techniques.
Considering that we have dodge and block, dodge would be the art of evading attacks completely and would have to be based on something (which could be unarmed fighting techniques), while block would have more in common with defensive weapon fighting.

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TheLostOne
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« Reply #108 on: January 02, 2008, 12:22:26 pm »

Quote
True, but instead of going with one MORTAL COMBAT skill, for role-playing/character development  reasons it's more fun to split combat into several different skills.

I agree.  That is why I think of dodge/block/parry as being incorporated in with your weapons skill for a cohesive fighting style.  They are merely representative of the characters strengths in fighting.  Whether you want to play a quick nimble fencer type swordfighter or a powerful, overwhelming claymore type, or even an all arounder the skills give you the option.

That greco-roman style of unarmed combat sounds interesting.  Are you considering implementing it as a skill or just bringing it up to point to a period martial art?

The way you described it a dodge scroll could work well, just sat with me wrong the first time I considered the concept.
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Frost
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« Reply #109 on: January 02, 2008, 12:45:44 pm »

HEy... wheres the unarmed fighting skill ?  There arent any ? Is there an unarmed fighting after all ?
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Vince
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« Reply #110 on: January 02, 2008, 01:03:42 pm »

No.
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Frost
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« Reply #111 on: January 02, 2008, 01:30:03 pm »

A pity then... It could be sweet to have some wrestling moves for example... throws and such... huge potential
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cardtrick
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« Reply #112 on: January 02, 2008, 01:43:24 pm »

Where/how is ammo equipped?  I didn't see a slot for it.
You don't equip it. Same mechanics as with Fallout ammo. You shoot, then you click reload (you have options for different ammo type), then you shoot again, then you reload, etc. Bows are slow to shoot, fast to reload. Crossbows are fast to shoot, slow to reload.

This sounds annoying to me. It was fine for Fallout, where most weapons could hold at least 6 rounds, but for a bow or crossbow that can only hold one arrow? I don't know.

Please at least consider having the option to auto-reload your bow/crossbow -- of course, this should still use the requisite number of action points, but I think it's always good to spare the player from repeatedly performing an action that is neither fun nor challenging.

A bunch of good suggestions for skill items

Nice job, these all sound quite reasonable. I prefer Vince's idea to the dodge armor, I think, since a suit of armor seems too valuable. For trading, I prefer the idea of a voucher for a discount, or maybe some trinkets and a mini-quest to deliver them to a given merchant. For lore, I prefer your idea of writing utensils/parchment (especially given the passive skill bonus of forging documents). For etiquette and streetwise, rather than items boosting reaction I would prefer simply a starting numerical increase to reaction for the appropriate factions -- etiquette boosting the noble houses by +5, maybe, and streetwise boosting the shadier organizations. I think the idea of items with attached reputation/reaction boosts is a little problematic. Possibly do something similar for persuasion, but I'm not sure that makes sense. Something quest-related as you suggested would probably be better.

You start with a scroll, and when you go to the loremaster, you get an extra dialogue option:

What can I get for this scroll?
The Circular Dodge technique? (going with the names from the link above here) I don't believe I have this one. I can pay you 100 imperials or I can give you a copy of the Sliding Retreat technique. What do you say?
...
Simple as that.

Sounds good to me. Not cheesy at all.

Quote from: The Thread Topic
Let's Play AoD!

Yes, let's!

EDIT:

A pity then... It could be sweet to have some wrestling moves for example... throws and such... huge potential

That requires a huge amount of animation work that's very tricky and can't be reused for other skills. I can't imagine it being worth it.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2008, 01:45:30 pm by cardtrick » Logged
puppyonastik
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« Reply #113 on: January 02, 2008, 01:47:52 pm »

A pity then... It could be sweet to have some wrestling moves for example... throws and such... huge potential

I agree, I think you should consider an unarmed fighting skill, Vince. More choices for the player. Besides, unarmed in PtD was pretty neat (I liked making kung-fu doctors as party members). Unfortunately you have the disarm trait on another weapon and I can't think up a good original trait for unarmed at the moment.

Edit:
Quote

That requires a huge amount of animation work that's very tricky and can't be reused for other skills. I can't imagine it being worth it.


Well if it's that difficult then nvm, i guess. Sad For the next game then!
« Last Edit: January 02, 2008, 01:49:36 pm by puppyonastik » Logged

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Vince
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« Reply #114 on: January 02, 2008, 02:03:31 pm »

This sounds annoying to me. It was fine for Fallout, where most weapons could hold at least 6 rounds, but for a bow or crossbow that can only hold one arrow? I don't know.
We'll consider it. We split using bows/xbows into shooting and reloading to reflect the difference between two weapon types. This way you can carry a loaded xbow, quickly pull the trigger and switch to another weapon without reloading the xbow.
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Oscar
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« Reply #115 on: January 02, 2008, 02:32:05 pm »

Maybe bind the letter "R" change between manual and automatic reload.
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axedice
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« Reply #116 on: January 02, 2008, 02:36:07 pm »

You don't need to give starter items for all skills. If you're a swordsman, you have a sword and a hundred gold. If you're a smart-talker, you have your wits and a hundred gold. Same goes for dodge, sneak, etiquette etc.

So we're an assassin with Crossbow, Dodge, Streetwise, and Criticals. What happens next?
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Priapist
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« Reply #117 on: January 02, 2008, 03:17:00 pm »

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Merging the skill books with the lore worked great in Morrowind IMO.

Not really, because for players like me who don't play games to read metafiction, you're instead just going through libraries and "grinding" for bonuses.

Quote
Unarmed

I think it's better left alone. Grappling alone becomes a far from trivial aspect to work into a system, and is an animators nightmare. You could probably make a whole game out of MMA style fighting.
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zhirzzh
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« Reply #118 on: January 02, 2008, 04:38:03 pm »

Quote
Merging the skill books with the lore worked great in Morrowind IMO.

Not really, because for players like me who don't play games to read metafiction, you're instead just going through libraries and "grinding" for bonuses.

I agree. I love in-game books if they're well done (Arcanum), but giving stat bonuses for reading them penalizes people who don't like them and shows a lack of confidence in their quality.

As to unarmed, there's no reason to bother if it's Fallout style punches and kicks, and too much trouble if it's more complex.
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Rhett Butler
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« Reply #119 on: January 02, 2008, 07:01:28 pm »

Quote
Merging the skill books with the lore worked great in Morrowind IMO.

Not really, because for players like me who don't play games to read metafiction, you're instead just going through libraries and "grinding" for bonuses.

That is a problem, but hardly an unsolvable one. Skill books could be tagged in the item description "You have heard of this book, apparently it contains some useful insights into the art of dodging." Or maybe just a slightly different coloured icon if that seems a little... ghey. Or an even better solution would be to have the skill books and lore books (or scrolls as the case may be) separate, but to allow skill bonuses/techniques to be gained from certain texts by one who has a high enough Int (or lore skill, but I think Int makes more sense). It would be a decent perk for playing a Loremaster.
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